When an attorney is a 'Debt Collector' (as per their own documents) and not legally considered a 'Collection Agency' the attorney is not held accountable for consumer protection law violations (both local and federal) within civil court.
This loop hole needs to be addressed.
The attorneys/debt collectors are not monitored by the state bar because it is a collection practice (the attorneys buy old debt and then collect upon that debt in civil court) and the state and federal civil courts are not monitoring the attorneys because it is an attorneys office and not considered a collection agency - even though the attorneys buy old debt then take alleged debtors to civil court.
I personally know of a very large attorney agency in Washington State that even gives classes thru the Washington state bar to other attorneys because it is a easy caseload to win.
As per state and federal laws; 'Collectors cannot pursue a debt once you've proven that it's not yours. So if you don't owe it, you need to act. Ask your bank or creditors to give you written proof, then send a copy of that proof to the collection agency.'
I received a bill from an attorneys office regarding a bill I did not think that was mine. I sent a certified return receipt request for validation but never received a response. So I sent a 2nd certified return receipt - request for validation and again never received a response. The attorneys office filed a civil suit and took me to court. I explained this to the judge and gave proof. The proof I submitted into the court file were copies of request of validation, the USPS certified letter statement's and request verification receipt statement's. This was all ignored by the judge because I was pro se and did not know Washington state law. I had made the request prior to this case being filed. Later it was explained to me by an attorney that the local county civil courts do not enforce federal laws, only state laws and in state court a request for validation is not recognized.
Please note: I also requested proof of licensing which I did not receive because the plaintiff was and currently is not a licensed in Washington state as a debt collection agency - they are attorneys.
The plaintiff won their case and I owed a debt that was not mine.
I ask you, where is the fairness in this?
What needs to occur is the laws need to be made clear for both the lay person and the judicial system.
Moderator, I do not believe that it would have mattered. It seemed that the Attorney/debt collector was not looking for the actual debtor - I believe that all that they were trying to do was to make a quick buck. They did a couple of shady things with this case.
For a solution; the laws should be written so the common lay person can understand. If I had known that a validation request would not be considered I would not have wasted my time and paid even though it was NOT my debt.
Please note - I am NOT an attorney.
I have already spoken with an attorney. This is how I found out about the separation of state and federal law. Because I was sued in state civil court is why my validation requests were ignored by the plaintiffs as well as the seating judge. What I should have done (in state court) was sent a 'discovery' request AFTER the case had been filed rather then a validation request. Please note - the 'collection agency' was a large legal firm. They knew the laws well and whereas I was a lay person and not versed in law , I was like a sitting duck just waiting for the slaughter. If I did take them to court I would receive hundreds but it would cost me thousands....and I just do not have that type of money.
What really touched my heart was sitting in that court room and seeing others that also thought that the law would be fair if they represented themselves. Needless to say, we all lost and lost big time. I asked the judge why would he allow this when the plaintiff was a unlicensed collection agency and he stated ' they look like attorneys to me'.
I knew that at that point I had lost my case.
JOULES
1When an attorney is a 'Debt Collector' (as per their own documents) and not legally considered a 'Collection Agency' the attorney is not held accountable for consumer protection law violations (both local and federal) within civil court. This loop hole needs to be addressed. The attorneys/debt collectors are not monitored by the state bar because it is a collection practice (the attorneys buy old debt and then collect upon that debt in civil court) and the state and federal civil courts are not monitoring the attorneys because it is an attorneys office and not considered a collection agency - even though the attorneys buy old debt then take alleged debtors to civil court. I personally know of a very large attorney agency in Washington State that even gives classes thru the Washington state bar to other attorneys because it is a easy caseload to win.
View this comment in the discussion thread
JOULES
2As per state and federal laws; 'Collectors cannot pursue a debt once you've proven that it's not yours. So if you don't owe it, you need to act. Ask your bank or creditors to give you written proof, then send a copy of that proof to the collection agency.' I received a bill from an attorneys office regarding a bill I did not think that was mine. I sent a certified return receipt request for validation but never received a response. So I sent a 2nd certified return receipt - request for validation and again never received a response. The attorneys office filed a civil suit and took me to court. I explained this to the judge and gave proof. The proof I submitted into the court file were copies of request of validation, the USPS certified letter statement's and request verification receipt statement's. This was all ignored by the judge because I was pro se and did not know Washington state law. I had made the request prior to this case being filed. Later it was explained to me by an attorney that the local county civil courts do not enforce federal laws, only state laws and in state court a request for validation is not recognized. Please note: I also requested proof of licensing which I did not receive because the plaintiff was and currently is not a licensed in Washington state as a debt collection agency - they are attorneys. The plaintiff won their case and I owed a debt that was not mine. I ask you, where is the fairness in this? What needs to occur is the laws need to be made clear for both the lay person and the judicial system.
View this comment in the discussion thread
JOULES
3
Moderator, I do not believe that it would have mattered. It seemed that the Attorney/debt collector was not looking for the actual debtor - I believe that all that they were trying to do was to make a quick buck. They did a couple of shady things with this case. For a solution; the laws should be written so the common lay person can understand. If I had known that a validation request would not be considered I would not have wasted my time and paid even though it was NOT my debt. Please note - I am NOT an attorney.
View this comment in the discussion thread
JOULES
4
I have already spoken with an attorney. This is how I found out about the separation of state and federal law. Because I was sued in state civil court is why my validation requests were ignored by the plaintiffs as well as the seating judge. What I should have done (in state court) was sent a 'discovery' request AFTER the case had been filed rather then a validation request. Please note - the 'collection agency' was a large legal firm. They knew the laws well and whereas I was a lay person and not versed in law , I was like a sitting duck just waiting for the slaughter. If I did take them to court I would receive hundreds but it would cost me thousands....and I just do not have that type of money. What really touched my heart was sitting in that court room and seeing others that also thought that the law would be fair if they represented themselves. Needless to say, we all lost and lost big time. I asked the judge why would he allow this when the plaintiff was a unlicensed collection agency and he stated ' they look like attorneys to me'. I knew that at that point I had lost my case.
View this comment in the discussion thread